Kevin Wohlman [00:00:00]: Today, I received an email from this guy. Here's what it says. I'm so happy to have finally found an over the calf sock that stays up all day. I've been looking for a brand other than Gold Toe, which offers limited colors and styles. I've tried a good number of brands, but none have actually stayed up as they should. That is until Southern Scholar. In a nutshell, why I like these? 1, they do what they claim. They stay up. Kevin Wohlman [00:00:21]: 2, very soft and comfortable. 3, they leave no imprints on skin after a full day of wear. 4, nice style and color options. 5, this is making me laugh, immediate and responsive customer service from owner CEO. Reginald Ferguson [00:00:34]: Hello. I'm Reg. And I'm Tiff. And we're the fashion geeks. Trying to make New York and the world New York is the world. A little flyer, one outfit And podcast. At a time. I like socks. Reginald Ferguson [00:00:51]: I take them very seriously. My grandpa was in the gold tub because he was, I was. I like the yellow going through the tub. It looks serious but also fun. I like that. Come to find out, that toe was not just high. It took a lot for that toe to have a hole. Sometimes I would puncture it, but it was a rare occurrence. Reginald Ferguson [00:01:19]: Most of these named designer brands are garbage. Are there any new brands to upset the hotel? Yo. This is Reg Ferguson, fashion geek number 1. How are you? Welcome to the ride. Thank you so much for listening. Please tell your friends about us. Please tell them to subscribe and please give us a review on Apple Podcasts. Special shout goes to our producer search and everyone down with the Fashion Geeks. Reginald Ferguson [00:01:54]: If you have a question or a story suggestion, you can email me at podcast@nyfashiongeek.com or hit me up on the insta@newyorkfashiongeek. Today, we're gonna talk with Kevin Wollman of the Southern Scholar who's in Dallas, Texas. We're going to talk about something that the everyday man should be paying close attention to. We're going to talk about dress socks. K Dub in the building. How are you, man? Kevin Wohlman [00:02:24]: I'm good. How are you? Reginald Ferguson [00:02:26]: I'm well. Thank you. Are you keeping safe out there? Kevin Wohlman [00:02:28]: We are. Well, you know, it's up for opinion, I guess. Reginald Ferguson [00:02:33]: That was kind of my that was kind of my point. Kevin Wohlman [00:02:36]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:02:39]: So before we go into our topic, please tell us, so what do you do? Kevin Wohlman [00:02:59]: Sure. Yeah. So I am the founder and CEO of Southern Scholar. We are a menswear accessories brand. Our primary product is, what I call the modern dress sock, basically a reengineered version of what everybody knows to be. The common dress sock, which is essentially a a cotton based, sock that tends to fall down your leg, not last in the wash, you know, get rid of with holes quite quickly, be uncomfortable, leave, constricting marks on your calves, yada yada yada. Just kind of a a garment that's been forgotten about, despite the fact that we wear them every day. So kinda spent the last 6 years of my life, you know, reengineering those to be more comfortable form fitting, stay up on your leg, etcetera. Kevin Wohlman [00:03:43]: And now we're kind of moving into other men's wear accessories like ties and pocket squares. Reginald Ferguson [00:03:48]: So how has your brand and your business been doing during COVID, Kevin? Kevin Wohlman [00:03:55]: It's been doing well. It's been doing really well. I think when things started happening last March, nobody really had any idea what, you know, was going on, how long things were gonna last, when, you know, normalcy was gonna return. And because of that, a lot of marketing departments in both, you know, large and small companies decided they would kind of, you know, take the foot off the gas, save a little nest egg just in case, and see what, you know, what what happens. We kinda went the opposite way. As a small brand, when lifestyle changes for a lot of people, it often opens up an opportunity. Your first reaction maybe to kind of, you know, duck and run or or save that nest egg like a lot of these larger companies have done or started to do. But we kinda looked at it more from a perspective of people psychology. Kevin Wohlman [00:04:53]: Admittedly, I was a little bit worried at first that something like a dress sock, especially, you know, a premium dress sock that's higher on the price point would be the first thing people are cutting when they're no longer, you know, getting dressed up to go in the office. But on the other side of things, I realize and recognize that when people aren't going to the office and spending, you know, 10, 15, $20 on lunch, they're not taking their, you know, wives or their husbands out to dinner. You know, after work, they're not going to the bar. They're not going to happy hour. They're not going to vacation during the weekend. For my clients that that whose, you know, whose income wasn't necessarily affected by COVID, if anything, they now have more discretionary income. Not only that, but they're likely spending a lot more time in front of screens than they usually would be now that they're working from home. They're also probably looking for a sense of normalcy. Kevin Wohlman [00:05:44]: And for a lot of people, they, default to kind of retail therapy. So rather than cutting our marketing budget and saving that nest egg and kind of playing scared, we took the opportunity to increase our marketing efforts. You know, we also recognize that a lot of larger companies that are targeting the same demographic that we are, they were no longer spending on platforms like Facebook. There were movies that had to stop shooting that, you know, had huge multi multi multimillion dollar budgets with Facebook for for marketing purposes that are targeting, you know, men 35 to 65. They had to stop shooting, thus they canceled those contracts. They're no longer gonna be, you know, marketing a movie they're not shooting. So that opens up a huge opportunity and lowers acquisition costs for companies like us that are willing to kinda take that risk and and push on forward. So I guess that's a very, very long winded way of saying we we did just fine throughout the pandemic. Kevin Wohlman [00:06:45]: We've, you know, we have a very loyal customer base, and and they help us get it through help to get us through it. But I think not I think being more, okay with risk, we we was a good, strategy for us. Reginald Ferguson [00:07:05]: Approximately, what was the increase in your ad spend during obviously we're still existing in COVID, Kevin Wohlman [00:07:14]: but you Reginald Ferguson [00:07:14]: know what I mean? Starting from last year, off the top of your head, what do you think your increase was percentage wise? Kevin Wohlman [00:07:21]: Well, from February, just before, you know, COVID really hit or before, you know, we were aware of it, I guess I should say, to mid April, we probably tripled our ad spend. Reginald Ferguson [00:07:33]: Woah. Kevin Wohlman [00:07:34]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:07:37]: And is your advertisement because you and I met on the gram. Correct. So and I see your ads. Kevin Wohlman [00:07:46]: Yeah. If you've if you've gone to our website, you will be bombarded with ads. Fair warning for the audience. Reginald Ferguson [00:07:53]: Well, I I interact with your ads when I'm going between Instagram stories. Kevin Wohlman [00:07:59]: Mhmm. Reginald Ferguson [00:08:00]: So so my question is, and you've partially answered it, where you know, what platforms, where where where are your ads? Sure. Kevin Wohlman [00:08:09]: Our our primary, top of funnel advertising is done on Facebook and Instagram. For those of you that aren't familiar, top of funnel just means the way that we get in front of, people that have not engaged with our brand in any way, shape, or form prior. So we do a lot on Instagram feeds and stories, Facebook feeds and stories, little bit audience network, but that is definitely our primary top of funnel marketing channel. Secondarily would be email for kind of follow-up, and repeat purchase and and customer loyalty and things like that. But, yeah, I mean, if you if you hit our website, you're gonna get retargeted with kind of all the cool things we have we have going and coming up. Reginald Ferguson [00:08:53]: Sure. And are you shooting those ads to an agency in Dallas, or is it more a little bit of a DIY? I mean, because they're very slick. They're very professional. Kevin Wohlman [00:09:07]: Sure. Reginald Ferguson [00:09:07]: I just interacted with 1 yesterday. Kevin Wohlman [00:09:11]: Yeah. So, for the first we've been in business about 5 and a half years, I wanna say, since since launch. I've been working on about 6 and a half. We've been live for about 5 and a half. For the first five, I was running all of our creative, and kind of, you know, hiring a photographer, scheduling photo shoots, styling photo shoots, etcetera. And just recently, about a month and a half ago, maybe 2 months ago, we brought on, a creative agency that's new to Dallas. Not, not necessarily a new agency, but new to Dallas. And we've been running all the creative with them. Kevin Wohlman [00:09:49]: They are very, very good at what they do. I think the quality of our content over the past 6 weeks has has 10 x'd, compared to what I was doing prior. You know, so I would definitely say that, yeah, the first five and a half years were very much kind of DIY. Not that I was, you know, I was not the photographer by any means. I I often did, some of the modeling, but I would find, you know, local photographers and upcoming photographers and use them, and kinda schedule out those shoots. And now, I mean, I'm still extremely, extremely, involved in the creative process and kinda make the decision on what, you know, content's gonna be shot, what I think we need, for marketing purposes at at each point in the funnel and things like that. But these guys are really leading the shoots, you know, telling me what to do, where to go, how to style things, how they're shooting things, and then, they edit it and and I kind of, you know, we we work together to get the copy on there, but they're doing an incredible job. Anything you've seen in the past couple of weeks that you reference, I imagine, is is what they've put together. Reginald Ferguson [00:10:51]: Yeah. It looks it looks very slick. Obviously, I haven't been with you since the inception of the business. Mhmm. I think I started following you on the gram. I'm not certain, but certainly over a year ago. Kevin Wohlman [00:11:03]: Okay. Reginald Ferguson [00:11:04]: So but I think particularly since we started interacting about setting up this interview less than a month ago, I've been more attentive Sure. To your creative. Mhmm. So, kudos to you. This means this means you're moving up in the world, mister Ward. Kevin Wohlman [00:11:21]: I'd like to think so. Reginald Ferguson [00:11:24]: It's actually happening. So, Kevin, I got to get right down to it. Sure. So your sock is 100% synthetic. Kevin Wohlman [00:11:38]: That's correct. Reginald Ferguson [00:11:41]: You are talking with an old school Gold Toe guy. Kevin Wohlman [00:11:45]: Yes. Reginald Ferguson [00:11:48]: So my two reference points when we have this conversation to let you know are going to be Go to and. Kevin Wohlman [00:11:58]: K. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:00]: And one could argue you're somewhere in the middle. Kevin Wohlman [00:12:05]: Yeah. Yeah. Argue. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:08]: Yeah. Effectively, successfully? I don't know. We're gonna find out in this conversation. Kevin Wohlman [00:12:14]: Sure. I'm excited. This is my favorite topic. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:18]: Good. Well, it should be because it's your business. Kevin Wohlman [00:12:20]: Yes, sir. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:21]: And but fortunately, I think for the audience, you're talking to a guy who has a lot of opinions about socks. Kevin Wohlman [00:12:29]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:30]: Because I've been wearing them all my life. Kevin Wohlman [00:12:33]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:12:34]: And I have a certain level of brand loyalty. I also want to make clear to the audience, you were very kind in your largest to provide me with with some pairs for me to test drive, so to speak. Correct. I have to tell you, it could be you. It could be Go to. It could be Brashan. It could be anyone. Candidly, the test for a successful review of a sock for me is me talking to you a year from now. Reginald Ferguson [00:13:07]: Yeah. Because putting on a sock now, the sock is fine. Sure. I like the sock. It's nice. It's cool. I like the colors because I picked them. I like the graphics because I picked them. Reginald Ferguson [00:13:24]: But I'm gonna keep it real with you. My toenails, I don't know why it's a genetic thing. They're like razors. I have razors. I rip through sheets. So you can imagine what I do with a sock. So for me, the beauty of Go to, which clearly even their name is an amazing marketing piece. Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:13:53]: But because I know you've done research on so many sock brands, you know the history of that name. They weave linen into their toe, and they found that the linen is stronger than the cotton or wool that they normally have used historically. Kevin Wohlman [00:14:15]: Yeah. Many, many things are stronger than cotton and wool, which is why we use neither in our blend. Reginald Ferguson [00:14:22]: Okay, bro. So come at me. Why do you feel so you know what you were doing? You're like, that's why. Yeah, sir. Okay. Yeah. All Alright. Well, take that. Reginald Ferguson [00:14:34]: Take that. Okay. So why do you feel so confident, so comfortable in the position of having a 100% synthetic sock. Kevin Wohlman [00:14:50]: Yeah. I'm gonna tell you. I'm excited for this. Let's start with this. Why were synthetic fibers created? If we have natural fibers, why did we create synthetics? Reginald Ferguson [00:15:03]: Is, are you posing me this question or is this a rhetorical one? Kevin Wohlman [00:15:06]: Yeah. Well, I'd like to see a response. Reginald Ferguson [00:15:08]: Sure. For convenience, for cost, meaning lowering. I mean, when we're talking about anything in the fashion sense, if we're talking about a synthetic versus a natural fiber, it's about a convenient source that's cheaper and that can be replicated at the drop of a hat. Kevin Wohlman [00:15:32]: Okay. That's one way to look at it. Sure. Let's go to a second point here. When you go to the gym, and I'm I'm imagining you haven't done so in in a while, but when you are going to the gym, are you wearing a cotton Hanes t shirt? Are you wearing something that's more a performance fabric, something that's a little bit better with shape retention, moisture weakening? Reginald Ferguson [00:15:57]: Kev, you talked about old school cat. So it's the former. Ironically, I probably utilize the latter when I'm chilling. So meaning my Nike tops, which are sports tops. So let's say because quiet is kept, I'm not suited and booted every day. So let's say it's a Saturday or Sunday, particularly Sunday. Hey, I may be rocking my Brazil National Jersey. You know and I know that's a dry fit top. Kevin Wohlman [00:16:29]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:16:29]: So that checks off all the boxes that you were for mentioned. But when I'm in the gym, no, I'm an old school cat. It's generally 100% cotton. Certainly, I think to your point, if I was doing mad cardio in the gym, which I never really did, then, yeah, it would weigh me down. But if I'm working on different body types, it's not it's not it's not a big deal for me. Kevin Wohlman [00:16:56]: So I can totally understand that because I'm I'm in the similar respect to that. I wear generally t shirts to the gym. I'm not you know, I wear Lululemon shorts. But as far as my shirt, I I'm kind of the same. I wear old T shirts, old hockey T shirts, things like that. Reginald Ferguson [00:17:16]: I'm not Kevin Wohlman [00:17:17]: gonna I'm not gonna spend $80 on a, on a really nice workout shirt that I'm gonna wear once a week and then have to wash, dry, etcetera. But the bulk of the people in the gym, at least where I go, they are doing that. And this is why. If you have a Hanes cotton t shirt on and you yank on the collar, especially when it's wet and sweaty or whatever, you know, you're pulling on the collar because it's uncomfortable, it stretches out, it's gonna stay down like that. It's not gonna Sure. It's not gonna shoot back up into its original shape. So shape shape retention is huge with synthetics. That's why every every performance fabric, one of their biggest, you know, selling points is is shape retention. Kevin Wohlman [00:17:56]: The other one is gonna be, breathability, whether or not it's moisture wicking, whether, you know, if you are doing a bunch of cardio, your cotton t shirt is soaked and it's gonna remain soaked for 2 hours. If you're wearing an Under Armour, you know, performance fabric, shirt and you're doing a bunch of cardio, yeah, you're gonna sweat. But while you're sweating, that thing is breathing, that thing's wicking away that moisture, the the fibers inside are drying it. And you're gonna be a lot more comfortable in that regard. So in my opinion, synthetics, I'm not gonna sit here and tell you that that some synthetics weren't created out of, you know, necessity of cost and replication. But I am gonna tell you that a lot of synthetics were built for, the fact that the natural fibers that we had lacked certain attributes that were needed for certain things. Reginald Ferguson [00:18:39]: Sure. Kevin Wohlman [00:18:39]: And so the reason that I'm so confident in our blend is that we combine several synthetics that both complement each other and then also make up for things that the others are missing. And what that allows our socks to do is form fit to your foot and leg. I think you'll agree and and and just to be clear with the audience, I made sure that you had received your order and had a chance to try them before we scheduled this, correct? Reginald Ferguson [00:19:03]: That is correct. Kevin Wohlman [00:19:04]: That's because I wanted your honest opinion on some of these things. So I am gonna I'm gonna be honest and tell you that I have not tried a gold toe sock in 5 years. I actually was not even aware that they started doing patterns until very recently when ironically I had a customer reach out or, someone soon to be a customer reach out and say, here's the deal. I wanna buy your socks. I wanna take advantage of this intro offer where I get, you know, 4 pairs for the the price of 3. But I'm gonna tell you that I don't have high expectations. The only socks that I've ever had that have performed for me are gold toe. Here's why. Kevin Wohlman [00:19:45]: You know, be honest with me. Do you think I'm gonna like your socks? And I said, Yeah. I'm very confident that you'll like them. And if you don't, we offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee. So if if they aren't the best socks you ever worn, we give your money back. So if you decide, hey, I'm sticking with Gold Toe, you're getting your your money back. Today, I received an email from this guy. Here's what it says. Kevin Wohlman [00:20:07]: I'm so happy to have finally found an over the calf sock that stays up all day. I've been looking for a brand other than Gold Toe, which offers limited colors and styles. I've tried a good number of brands, but none have actually stayed up as they should. That is until Southern Scholar. In a nutshell, why I like these? 1, they do what they claim. They stay up. 2, very soft and comfortable. 3, they leave no imprints on skin after a full day of wear. Kevin Wohlman [00:20:29]: 4, nice style and color options. 5, this is making me laugh, immediate and responsive customer service from owner CEO. So that is a review that he left for us after he sent me an email yesterday and said, hey. You know, I really am happy with the purchase. Here's why. And I said, Christian, I really appreciate that. If if you wouldn't mind throwing that up as an as a review, you know, that would that would that would be awesome for us. And I and by no means that I get on this podcast expecting to just read reviews and and pitch my product. Kevin Wohlman [00:20:59]: But because you brought up Gold Toe, this is now becoming kind of a trend, that some of our customers are coming over from Gold Toe because that's the brand that that they find that stays up and and has that durable toe box. So to get back to your point, because of the blend that we use, not only does it form fit and stay up, not only, can we combine these fibers to be incredibly soft, moisture wicking, antimicrobial, etcetera, but the durability aspect is also there. And one of the biggest reasons I started this company is when I was walking to my first job out of college, I lived about a mile away from my office in downtown Dallas. By the time I would get to my office, my socks were down on my ankle. So now I'm pulling them back up. The whole rest of the day, I'm doing the same thing. Then I start noticing everybody else in my office is doing that. They're stopping halfway down the hallway, pulling up their socks, walking to their cubicle. Kevin Wohlman [00:21:51]: I see them, you know, bending over the chair, pulling up their socks, etcetera. Well, I walked to the office already. Now I gotta walk home at the end of the day. I get home. I got a brand new pair of socks on. I've worn maybe once or twice. I take my shoe off, and I got a hole in the toe box. Reginald Ferguson [00:22:05]: What? Kevin Wohlman [00:22:06]: Huge, huge problem for me was holes in the toe box, or the heel wearing down really thin after a couple of wears just from that that natural slide, you know, as you're walking your dress shoe if it's a little bit too big. Sure. And the other side was was the styling. I mean, I I was out there looking for some way to not dress exactly like everybody else in my office. Once once the professional world kinda shifted from business professional suits, ties, pocket squares to business casual, slacks shirt or chinos shirt, it really left a lack of options for guys to look different. I mean, 99% of the guys in the office from day to day are gonna be wearing a navy trouser and a white button up or a khaki trouser and a blue button up. And so the only way that guys were, you know, really had to differentiate themselves, show a little bit of style was their socks. The problem was a lot of the guys in my office are wearing, you know, bright orange and black polka dots with a with a navy slack and a and a green polo, and it just didn't go. Kevin Wohlman [00:23:13]: And so I'm out there trying to find these styles that I find, you know, office appropriate but also unique. And as soon as I find a brand that that offers that, well, then then they're falling down my leg. They're getting holes in the toe after a few washes, and I'm just wasting a bunch of money. So that was really what what pushed me to start this company and and and what made me start testing different materials. I mean, I have no experience in textiles prior to this. I have no experience in product design prior to this, but I just I saw what I what what I found to be a need, not just for myself but for others and an opportunity. I found a garment that I thought has just been overlooked for for years upon years. It's just cotton poly blend or cotton wool blend. Kevin Wohlman [00:23:55]: They're all the same shape. Who cares if they fall down? Doesn't matter cause everybody's due. And I figured, hey, we can make these better. We can make them better in style. We can make them better in performance. We can make them better in fit and comfort. And so that's, you know, what I've what I spent the last 6 years doing. But the only way that our that our socks differ from these others is that we use those synthetic fibers. Kevin Wohlman [00:24:14]: We use them in the right proportions. We pair them with other fibers that, like I said, complement or make up for things that the other lacks. And I would say, you know, 1600 reviews, 97% 5 stars over 6 and a half years. If they weren't durable, I I don't think that'd be the case. Reginald Ferguson [00:24:32]: No, no, no, of course. And to be clear, your blend is polyester, viscose rayon, and nylon spandex. Is that correct? Kevin Wohlman [00:24:41]: Yeah. We use a 32 s one polyester, which is the highest grade. Polyester standard poly is gonna be a little, you know, scratchy, not so soft. The 32 s one is incredibly, incredibly soft. That's one of the the biggest compliments we get on our socks. The viscose, adds to kind of color retention, shape retention, provides a little bit of sheen to the pattern so that you don't, you know, take a beautiful pair of socks, throw it in the washer, take it out, and all of a sudden it's fuzzy and, you know, the colors kinda faded already and washed away. Nylon spandex is for elasticity, but the viscose and the polyester also have elastic attributes, and that's what makes our socks be able to kind of form fit. You'll you'll probably notice and I I'm not sure. Kevin Wohlman [00:25:26]: I'm looking at some of these gold toe socks. Some of them are actually quite nice patterns. But if you have any of their, you know, argyles or these ones that they call box plaid, that's kind of like a crossing pattern. A lot of brands do these. You might notice as you're trying to pull them up, they don't stretch uniformly throughout the entire sock. Maybe the footbed does or, you know, the the front where there's no pattern might Mhmm. The top, the band might. But the actual pattern itself, you might notice that, the the the elasticity, the stretch is not uniform throughout. Kevin Wohlman [00:26:01]: So we actually blend that that nylon and that spandex throughout our patterns instead of just in the, you know, toe box and the heel and the rib. And then like I said, the polyester also being kind of an elastic fiber when it's blended with those, it allows that uniform stretch. So you're gonna get that same stretch from one pattern to another. You're not gonna, to be trying to pull the polka dot and have it stop halfway because the polka dots aren't stretching. Reginald Ferguson [00:26:26]: Interesting. I found when I put on my pair that it definitely the elasticity was apparent that it slipped on and it felt consistent. That's an interesting point that you raised just previously. I never realized and I wanna be straight up and transparent and are conversing that for me, when I rock a gold toe sock, it's a solid. So I've never rocked the pattern ones. And that's gonna be something for you to chew on because the pattern socks that I do have prior to you throwing some my way for me to give an objective review. Oftentimes and again, I know you did a lot of research before you went to market. Oftentimes they're designer socks. Reginald Ferguson [00:27:26]: And I'm not saying that in a complimentary way because we all know if it's a designer sock, it's a licensing deal. And like I said, I have very sharp toenails. It's just crazy. So every few years I go through sheets. So one of my sheets is shredded. It just is what it is. So you can imagine what I potentially could do to a sock. The Fashion Geeks are hosted and powered by Blueberry. Reginald Ferguson [00:27:57]: That's Blueberry, b l u b r r y. Thinking of launching a podcast? Want your episodes to be deployed smoothly? Go to blueberry.com, type in the word fashion, and get a deal on us. Just put in the word fashion. Blueberry, always host fly. I would potentially be an outlier type of customer Uh-huh. Because of the composition of the calcium in my toenails. I need to go through these for a year, and then we're going to see how good they are. Kevin Wohlman [00:28:27]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:28:28]: Because I'm the king of darning, my friend. Kevin Wohlman [00:28:31]: Mhmm. Reginald Ferguson [00:28:32]: It's just it's just a fact of my life. Kevin Wohlman [00:28:35]: Yeah. I mean, I'm in a similar boat. I mean, different reasoning, but when I find, especially prior to, to this, when I find something that I like, whether it be a pair of trousers that just fits fits me right or that I really like, you know, the the subtle texture on or I find a shirt that fits me right, a pair of shoes I really like the look of that pairs a lot of things well. I beat those things to the ground. I beat them to the ground. I wear them all the time, and I used to do that with socks, and I still do that with socks. But you might be thinking I own the company, you know, I can wear a pair of socks for a couple weeks, wear the shit out of them, and then and then just give myself another pair. Actually don't do that because I I like to to do my own kind of quality control. Kevin Wohlman [00:29:21]: I have pairs of socks in my drawer that I've worn upwards of 50 times over the past, you know, 4 or 5 years that are still in in perfect condition. And what I really love is when I hop on Instagram, somebody tags me in a photo, and I go look at it. And I'm like, that's the 15th time you've tagged us in this photo. Those socks are from 2,015. I mean, that's saying something. Reginald Ferguson [00:29:41]: Yeah. No. It is. Kevin Wohlman [00:29:43]: Just yesterday, a gentleman that that's, that's been tagging us in pictures for a few years now, he tagged, a pair of socks. I would estimate probably the 10th or 12th time, and it was the 3rd pair of socks that I ever designed. 3rd pair of socks we ever released. So those were would have been released in, early 2016. And he's and he posted them yesterday. So, little things like that make me happy. We also like I said, we offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee and that includes durability. So if you reach out to us 3 years after you placed an order and say, hey, I really only wore these 6 or 7 times, and they've already got holes. Kevin Wohlman [00:30:25]: I'm not gonna say, well, you've had them for 6 years. I'm gonna say, well, here's a new pair. That hasn't happened before, but if it did, that's kinda how that's handled for us. We we truly believe that the quality of our product is so superior to others on the market that if you're not happy with it for any reason, you know, we make it right. Reginald Ferguson [00:30:45]: No. Clearly, you are standing by your product and you're being very humble. But I know you're not humble generally about this, that you go, hey, this is what we have and we feel so strongly about it. This is what we're going to do. And clearly it sounds that you're not going back and forth equivalent with the customer because anyway, you're just thinking about the overall customer service perspective. And knowing to your point that when you're looking at IG and when people are tagging you, you know, if it's a 1st generation sock, so on and so forth. But I'm also going to tease you because, listen, to me, a business school guy to another business school guy, you found a market need, you found a pain point, and you created an opportunity and kudos to you. But I guess this is where we're going to do the New York versus DFW conversation. Kevin Wohlman [00:31:46]: Hit Reginald Ferguson [00:31:47]: me. I feel that some of this had to do with I always say life is about exposure and the lack thereof. Kevin, I think you guys don't have a great array of options down in the DFW. And that's why you had this epiphany, because in doing my research, I got to tell you, I'm not saying that never in my life have a pair of socks sagged, but it hasn't happened for me in a mighty long time. And this is not an incidental shout out for Go Toe. Sure. Though, again, the majority of my socks, not all of them, the majority of them are of that brand. But to me sometimes and you know this, sometimes a sock sag is the interesting relationship between the sock and the shoe, particularly if it's a new shoe. Reginald Ferguson [00:32:46]: But other than that, again, I'm not saying it's never happened. Believe me, I have stories too. Stopped in the middle of the street, went to a curb, took my shoe off, pulled up my sock, kept walking. Kevin Wohlman [00:32:57]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:32:58]: Absolutely. That's happened to me. But I just feel like more times than not, it hasn't. So I just think that, hey, I don't know what's going on in Dallas. I don't know what's going on on retail. Sure. But, hey, maybe maybe you guys are not, maybe you don't have the breadth of options that we do up here in the north. But again Kevin Wohlman [00:33:23]: I think a lot of people nowadays are shopping for things like clothing online much more than they are in retail. So, I mean, you know, we have every option anybody else does with with ecommerce nowadays. One thing I will say about socks now that I've learned so much about them over the 6 years, which is a statement I never thought I'd say, is it definitely depends on the body type of the gentleman. So if you're more of a, tall skinny guy, don't have a huge calf muscle, and I hate to say it, but just kind of a normal shape foot and leg, Yeah. The jet that then the general the general sock is gonna fit you just fine, and is gonna stay up on just fine. The problem is when you find somebody who's, you know, a 10 double e, but they're £210, they got this huge calf. That's where the issues arise. Now I'll say I have a relatively normal body type. Kevin Wohlman [00:34:18]: I'm about 5 10, £180. I have played sports my whole life, so I have a decent calf muscle. That's that's about it. But I've had this issue with damn near every pair of socks I've ever or every brand I've ever purchased from. I will say there have been a couple that I've found fit me well, and don't fall down. But that kind of uniform stretch is what allows it to form fit and stay up on virtually any size, shape, foot, leg, etcetera. We actually offer a one size fits all, which we get just harped on on social media ads all the time. People saying, oh, how are you gonna tell me it fits a 9 and also a 14 and yada yada? The truth is it actually fits a bigger range than we advertise because we we've learned that people just aren't gonna believe it. Kevin Wohlman [00:35:08]: And that's something, like you said, you're getting kinda bombarded with our advertisements. You'll be seeing advertising that that, you know, directly answers those objections coming up pretty soon here. But one thing that I found really not necessarily surprising, but one thing I found unique about us, is I recently was able to add a secondary layer to our review question that asks you not only, you know, what did you think of this sock, but also, what size shoe do you wear? Oh. And I was blown away within I think I added that maybe a week and a half, two weeks ago. I was blown away that we already have reviews, talking about how great they fit all the way from a size 7 to a size 16. Woo. The same pair of socks. Reginald Ferguson [00:35:52]: Get out. Really? That type of range? Kevin Wohlman [00:35:54]: Yeah. So I'm looking right now. We have one from 312, from a size 8. We got one from 318 from a size 15. I've got one from a 10 double e. I'm not even sure what a double e means. I think that means double wide. It ain't narrow. Kevin Wohlman [00:36:13]: That's narrow? Reginald Ferguson [00:36:14]: No. I'm saying it's not narrow. Kevin Wohlman [00:36:15]: Oh, okay. Not narrow. Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:36:17]: Double e. Kevin Wohlman [00:36:18]: Alright. So, yeah, I mean, it just goes to show I mean, that fabric blend that we use and we also use a 200 needle count count knitting gauge. It's just gonna make it softer, a little more elastic. What it basically means is that it's a thinner yet denser weave. I know those sound like contradictory things, but it basically just allows the the fibers to be, tighter is not the right word. I mean, really thinner and denser is the only way I can I can describe it properly? But that's what allows for that that huge kind of range and fit. Here's another one from a size 15. That's that's what I'm talking about. Kevin Wohlman [00:36:56]: But anyway, the reason the only reason I'm bringing this up is I I was kinda surprised to hear you say that that no sock. You you don't generally have that that issue with socks. And I'm also surprised that just recently between you and this other gentleman that Gold Toe has come up, in the conversation so much. So I hopped on their website, and I noticed that a lot of their socks are a 100% synthetic material blends. Reginald Ferguson [00:37:19]: They they do now. Yeah. No. I I wanna I wanna keep it real. So they do blends now. There's no question. To your point, they have a yarn from recycled plastic bottles. So clearly this is a sustainability play. Kevin Wohlman [00:37:36]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:37:37]: But I think for me, and I can't speak for this other individual, Go To was a brand that my late grandfather rocked, and he was one of my fashion influencers. So he rocked that. I rocked it. And that continued and continues from adolescence to adulthood. I rock the, as you know, it's an old school term, the executive sock, which you know means over the calf. I like the high. And I'll be honest, the reason why I like that is because that mitigates the sag. Kevin Wohlman [00:38:21]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:38:22]: I'm definitely concerned about mid calf. Kevin Wohlman [00:38:25]: Yeah. I'm a Reginald Ferguson [00:38:25]: beep. No way. That makes a little more sense that Kevin Wohlman [00:38:27]: you haven't had that issue at all. Reginald Ferguson [00:38:29]: Yeah. Oh, no. I knew that that's a again, to be honest, I say it a lot on the pod, and I'm not trying to blow smoke, but I just realized in a comparison to other men in my peer group. I'm a fashion prodigy. So I understood that in grade school. Kevin Wohlman [00:38:45]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:38:46]: I was like, this doesn't work. I need higher. Kevin Wohlman [00:38:49]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:38:50]: And Yeah. So I never looked back. Kevin Wohlman [00:38:52]: Yeah. So that makes more sense now that you haven't really had that issue. We actually didn't even release an over the calf fit until, oh, god bless, maybe 8 months ago. Oh. You were mid calf only until about 8 months ago. Reginald Ferguson [00:39:04]: Oh. Oh, that would have been hard for you and I. Kevin Wohlman [00:39:07]: Yeah. Well, now I wanna ask you because I'd I've noticed that your order, you placed, 4 pairs were over the calf. 1 was mid calf. Did you try both fits? Reginald Ferguson [00:39:19]: No. Not yet. Okay. So I haven't for all transparency for the audience, I have not tried all 5 pairs because as I teased with you and it was such so nice of you to do it because I didn't solicit it. No. But I told you, I said, well, you know, Kevin, I'm not really not really wearing suits anymore. Right. So so when they came in, I forced myself. Reginald Ferguson [00:39:45]: I said, well, I've got to get one pair down Kevin Wohlman [00:39:47]: I know. Reginald Ferguson [00:39:47]: Before this meeting. Yeah. Kevin Wohlman [00:39:49]: So so I did. I just find it a lot easier to to talk about the product when a person tried it. You know what I mean? Reginald Ferguson [00:39:56]: Of course. But also, listen, you know, and I know you got a lot of people that are influencers, and they're like, hey, how about give me some socks? My point is I don't need socks. Like, I don't need shirts. Like, I don't need ties. Like, I don't need suits. I need clients. Yeah. So you and I will talk about that later on, Kevin Wohlman [00:40:19]: later on. I bought I bought 3, bespoke suits right when the pandemic hit, thinking I'd be, you know, out and about all year long. And, they haven't been worn for anything but photoshoots this far. Reginald Ferguson [00:40:31]: There you go. There you go. I just picked up big shout out to Oscar Torres of Los Torres Taylors. Before this interview, he and I, he came to my house and we are doing a suit collabo and I finally have it. And it's beautiful. We made some adjustments. It looked great today. And I see it across in its garment bag. Reginald Ferguson [00:40:57]: And as I tease with him, Lord knows when this will be worn for me to take the proper photos for he and I to use as an asset. Like, I just don't know what's gonna happen. I'm wearing a sport jacket today because I have a meeting after this pod with a person from my community board. But, yeah, so I wanted to make sure. And the reason why 4 or over the calf and one was mid is because I'm not a Argyle guy, and you had a Argyle offering, but you only had it mid calf. And I said, well, okay. I wanted to give it a whirl. Kevin Wohlman [00:41:35]: Give it a shot. Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:41:36]: Yeah, absolutely. Because it's a style that I've always liked from a afar, but I've never rocked. And I said, well, let me let me take the opportunity and and do it through you. Kevin Wohlman [00:41:48]: Yeah. I'm with you. The, the one you bought is actually what what I call a micro argyle. So it's a little bit different than most argyles on the market that are gonna be like 3 large, diamonds on the front basically. Ours is is kind of a a miniature version of that, like, just smaller diamonds. I like that sock a lot. It's it's called the Highlands. That's one that's sold really, really well. Kevin Wohlman [00:42:11]: But, yeah, we do only offer that one in in mid calf. We have a couple other Argyle that are more on the traditional design that we offer in OTC. But, I did notice when you ordered with when you place your order that only one was mid calf. I knew exactly why one was mid calf. I figured he either liked that style. I wanted to try that style and he told me in mid calf. But I'll tell you what, man. I'm blown away at how many people, reach out to us and they're like, hey. Kevin Wohlman [00:42:34]: I'm not an Argyle fan, but I bought some and and now I love them, and I'm buying all the rest of them. Because it definitely is a more traditional style that you don't see so often anymore. But they've kind of grown on me as well. I'll be honest. They're not my go to, but they have definitely grown on me over the past few years. Reginald Ferguson [00:42:56]: You have a nice variety. So, you know, and I know. And again, you know it from a research standpoint. I know it just from dent of what I do from consulting. We had a very strong period of loud and happy socks. And people have used socks as an accessory as well. They should and to provide that pop. Kevin Wohlman [00:43:28]: Right. Reginald Ferguson [00:43:30]: But you mentioned something that I had to laugh. You said, hey, in my office before I went the entrepreneurial route, people didn't know how to coordinate. And I always feel that's what I'm trying to provide to customers. So when someone goes fashion consultant, well, what is that? Are you a stylist? I'm like, no, I'm not a stylist. My point is, hey, let's try to figure out what goes with what, which really is a wonderful segue because you provide something that I want the audience to be aware of if they haven't purchased a pair of socks from you. You provide a signature style card. Kevin Wohlman [00:44:11]: Yes, sir. Reginald Ferguson [00:44:12]: Care to elaborate? Kevin Wohlman [00:44:14]: Absolutely. So, yeah, that was one of the biggest things on why I started this company was I just noticed so many guys didn't know how to kind of pair different garments, different colors, different patterns together. And and it's not it's not by fault of their own. I, you know, had to kinda teach myself this stuff, because generally speaking, you were lucky enough with your grandfather. But generally speaking, guys, you know, our dads aren't necessarily teaching us style etiquette, or how to pair certain things together when we're growing up. So by the time we get to the professional world, especially in a business casual environment, your thought is trousers, shirt, shoes. That's it. There's really not even a conversation of does this, you know, do the colors match? Do the fabrics? Are they proper for this time of year? When you're working, you know, in a business professional environment per se or for example, let's say, Wall Street 15 years ago, you're gonna go buy a suit. Kevin Wohlman [00:45:18]: The gentleman that's selling you the suit is gonna say, hey. And maybe it's an upsell for him to make a little more commission. Maybe it's that he's a good dude. But he's gonna say, hey, this tie, this shirt, this pocket square with that suit looks great. That can be, you know, one day of the week. We can also with that same suit, we can do this tie, shirt, pocket square. That'll give you a secondary look. The beauty of these ties, pocket squares, and shirts is that they also complement each other. Kevin Wohlman [00:45:43]: So if you wanna swap, you know, if you wanna wear this tie and pocket square with that shirt or with that shirt, it'll it'll, you know, work. And so guys at least had, you know, a a standard to go off of or a little bit of help. I remember when I started my job, and I actually I interned at at this firm 3 times prior to my full time year. Part of our orientation, which was like a week long, was, office attire etiquette. And the guy's section was about 3 minutes and 3 minutes. 3 minutes is being is being, liberal. It was, you know, here's a picture of a guy and some Dockers. Here's a picture of a guy and some trousers and here's a picture of a guy and jeans. Kevin Wohlman [00:46:22]: The jeans have a big x through them. But you can wear chinos or you can wear dress pants, basically. Here's, you know, shoes that are, that are appropriate. Here's a pair here's a pair of dress shoes. Here's a pair of loafers. Here's a pair of Nikes. The Nikes have a big x through it. Here's a t shirt. Kevin Wohlman [00:46:38]: Here's a golf polo. Here's a dress shirt. The t shirt had an x through it. That was our section of the office attire. The girl's section was the whole day after lunch. It was Wow. Very specific on the type of shoe, open toe, closed toe, how big can the heel be, platform, this, that, length of dress, style of dress, blouse, you know, can this be showing? Can shoulders be it was very, very, very specific on what constituted a business casual outfit for for a female. Mhmm. Kevin Wohlman [00:47:15]: But our section was, yo, wear some golf pants and a and a polo and and some shoes that aren't athletic shoes, and you're pretty much good. And so that did not help the problem either. It made it sound very, you know, throw some stuff together and call it a day. So needless to say, the women in our in our office were far better dressed than the men. And again, at no fault of of their own. So, yes, the style card was was a huge part of the business model from the very beginning. It was how can I provide these guys a style a pair of socks that's unique but professional, but also explain to them how to wear it to get the most out of their look so that they can leave the house confident that they look their best? That was the biggest thing. And to be honest, that's what really propelled me into this industry because I'm getting emails and reviews from people early on. Kevin Wohlman [00:48:07]: That was like, hey, man. I was very, self conscious about how I looked going to the office. I always worried that, you know, my superiors, the partners, the executives, whatever were, you know, weren't impressed by the way I was presenting myself. I was always worried that people were making comments about it cause I just didn't know what to do, and I can't afford, a personal shopper, stylist, or anything like that. And now when I leave the house, I know I got my my navy blue socks on. They pair well with these gray trousers I have. I throw on the brown shoes like your style card set and a white dress shirt. And I know that at least the colors match at the very least, right? Then I start getting reviews and emails from wives that are like, Hey, usually he comes down and I have to tell him, Are you kidding me? That tie doesn't go with this, doesn't go with that. Kevin Wohlman [00:48:54]: Go back upstairs and change. And I haven't had to do that lately because he gets up, he looks at that card, he puts his outfit together, he comes down, he looks great. So that is by far more rewarding to me than, you know, the fact that I provide a comfy, you know, product. The fact that people are are, you know, it's helping with their confidence and how they dress, that's huge. So our style cards go all the way from type and color of shoe, color, material, texture of suit, tie, pocket square, watch band color, belt, which should obviously match the shoe and the and the watch. But, it goes through the entire outfit. It shows you business casual. And then also if you wanna throw on a jacket with a tie and a pocket square, it goes into the the business professional vibe as well. Reginald Ferguson [00:49:39]: Yeah. I'm listen. You you're speaking my language, and you knew that. So I Kevin Wohlman [00:49:45]: know you were surprised and happy when I mentioned it last time we spoke. Reginald Ferguson [00:49:47]: Absolutely. Yeah. Let's let's talk about that with the audience. So so Kevin and I had an opportunity to talk before we set up the interview and he was very nice to me, ladies and gentlemen, because I had to shoot in my living room and it ran over And I was walking to do errands, but more importantly, I had to get my lunch on at around 3 o'clock if I recall. Kevin Wohlman [00:50:10]: Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:50:10]: And there was a whole bunch of noise. And Kevin hung in as I ordered my amazing sandwich at the. Oh, Kevin Wohlman [00:50:17]: that was good. Reginald Ferguson [00:50:18]: It was amazing because it's the. Kevin Wohlman [00:50:21]: Yeah. Nothing better than a New York Deli. Reginald Ferguson [00:50:22]: Absolutely. So this is a place, as I think I shared with you, is about to get a street named after it. So Kevin Wohlman [00:50:29]: Oh, yeah. Yeah. Reginald Ferguson [00:50:30]: I'm here to tell you. I think it's been around for 80 years. Yeah. So no. Yes. No. I I totally was surprised because, like I said, I've been following you on the gram, but I didn't know all that detail because I didn't think I'd ever be a customer. Because I have a gazillion socks, and I'm resigned to if they're not gold toe, that they're gonna die on me. Reginald Ferguson [00:50:51]: Right. So gold toes, you know, they stand the test of time and solids for me were always cool. It's not that I don't like a little pop or a little pattern. I do have some of my sock drawer, dude. And now and now I have you in addition to that. Kevin Wohlman [00:51:08]: Right. Yeah. I mean, we we try and bridge the gap between, you know, loud screaming for attention and dull boring. I'm not gonna lie to you. I'm huge on solids. I'm huge on rib solids. I think that some of the most, what's the word I'm looking for? I don't know. Some some of the most attractive looks for men can be achieved with minimal pattern. Reginald Ferguson [00:51:36]: Ding ding ding. Yeah. I totally agree. I love the rib joints. I love a solid rib joint. Kevin Wohlman [00:51:41]: Absolutely. So I'm I'm definitely more on the novelty side. And what I noticed when I, you know, before I started this company and when I mean, still today is, if you're walking into a meeting with a partner or what I did primarily at that kind of well, I didn't really do anything at that company, but my clients were primarily, old school, good old boy oil and gas guys. Reginald Ferguson [00:52:05]: Mhmm. Kevin Wohlman [00:52:05]: So imagine being a 21 year old kid, 22 year old kid wearing a pair of socks with slices of pizza on them and trying to go into a meeting with with a, you know, a $1,000,000,000 oil and gas CEO that has been very traditional, very business proper his whole life. That's not gonna go well. It's not gonna go well for the firm. It's not gonna go up for the meeting and it's damn sure not gonna go well for the guy with the pizza on his socks. So we tried to kinda give you, you know, give people the option of, hey, here's some some unique patterns where the colors at least pair. They complement each other. And very simply, I can tell you with items you already have in your closet, what you compare them with to kind of subdue them, make them a little more subtle. You still have a unique pattern. Kevin Wohlman [00:52:58]: You still have a cool style on. But you're not having this, what's the opposite? My brain is not working today. What's the word opposite of complementing? Reginald Ferguson [00:53:09]: Clashing. Kevin Wohlman [00:53:10]: Clashing. Exactly. So you can have I mean, you can look in our shop right now and see a pair of, you know, bright red socks and be like, oh, those are loud. Those are loud. But put in properly or put together properly with different colors and tones and textures, those can be a very, very subtle 2 inch color pop between the bottom of your trousers and the top of your shoes. If you're gonna wear something with a with a donut on it, socks with donuts and pink pink frosting and yellow and green and red, sprinkles, you're already so clashing on that one garment. There's no way you're gonna put together something that compliments that. There's it's just impossible. Reginald Ferguson [00:53:50]: Right. Kevin Wohlman [00:53:51]: So making sure that all of our patterns are put together, you know, with reason. Everything we design, we design around that business casual and business professional outfit that's gonna be on that card. It's not just, hey, let's sit down and make a red sock. It's, hey, this red sock would look great with navy, you know, navy slack, cognac, monk strap, white dress shirt, greyhound's tooth jacket, etcetera. So let's design it around that. You know, it's like the outfit comes before the sock. The sock is built around the outfit, and then that allows you to take that sock and build an outfit around it. Reginald Ferguson [00:54:26]: That makes sense. And it really leads into a wonderful segue because we're talking about pop. We're talking about stripes patterns. We're not talking about pizza and donuts. Kevin Wohlman [00:54:36]: Mm-mm. Reginald Ferguson [00:54:37]: What does the phrase always be fly mean to you, Kevin? Kevin Wohlman [00:54:42]: Oh, man. I don't know, man. I I just think that at some point in time, care for appearance started to kinda diminish. So just being aware, being conscious of of what you're putting on, why you're dressing for what you're about to go do. The littlest things can make the biggest difference. So even when you're going to the gym, you don't really care what you look like. But just picking a certain color shirt to pair with a certain color, you know, pants with a certain color shoes, you've got all that stuff in your closet. You're gonna wear it at some point that week anyway. Kevin Wohlman [00:55:15]: Why not, you know, take that extra second, to be conscious about what you're pairing together so that when you leave the house, you know, you look put together. Reginald Ferguson [00:55:25]: Makes sense. Seems like your socks do the job. Kevin Wohlman [00:55:28]: We hope so. So, Reg, I know we're coming up pretty much on time here, but I was curious if you could tell me a little bit about how, you know, the pandemic has affected your business. Because I imagine the majority of your business is kind of in person meetings and closet re hauls and shopping and things like that. Have you have you always had kind of that online aspect to it, or have you had to kinda ramp that up with everything going on? Reginald Ferguson [00:55:56]: Well, Kevin, you're right. We're we're running out of time. So unless we do a part 2 Kevin Wohlman [00:56:03]: I think we're doing a part 2 in a year from now to see how those socks work out. Right? Reginald Ferguson [00:56:07]: Absolutely. And the bare minimum. I think we'll have to talk about that on the IG live and hopefully on the clubhouse. Kevin Wohlman [00:56:13]: Okay. Yeah. I can I forgot about those?